Patrick Tate: No downward pressure at all I think actually Sean turned up and we found the evidence there a number of people would finally say finally we can put this debate to bed. Tate said that while a mountain lion sighting in New Hampshire isn't likely, it's not impossible. Russ, from Sandwich (and Bedford) asks: In Sandwich New Hampshire, everybody has a story about seeing a mountain lion. Patrick Tate: Well. Kyle I think about Rick Tate wants to jump in here. We rely on readers like you to support the local, national, and international coverage on this website. If you believe you have seen a mountain lion and want to report it to NH Fish and Game, please contact the Wildlife Division at (603) 271-2461 or wildlife@wildlife.nh.gov to request an observation report form. Peter Biello: Yeah some of what she was saying sounds like it would require getting pretty close or at least having a nice zoom lens right Sam like. You know one of the the biggest questions I have about that is it points to how much we don't know and if in fact we don't know enough. The great thing about pictures isn't the animal itself it's the background. Patrick Tate: Yeah yeah. And because you know things flow downhill and I was pushed to go investigate it more and met with the individual two or three times and there was a bunch of inconsistencies about the photograph. It was really muscular looking cat I mean is that like a side angle to me. The nonbelievers are going to say Show us your evidence and show us prove this to us. New Hampshire Fish and Game Department says there's no proof. Despite numerous reports, the NH Fish and Game Department continues to have no physical evidence of mountain lion presence in the state. Known to exist in the state for over well over a hundred years. It was not a bobcat. And Rick van de Poll naturalist and founder of ecosystem management consultants of New England. So when we hear mountain lion there's also cougar there's wild cat there's Bobcat which is not a mountain lion maybe Patrick could you sort of spell out the different terms which are synonymous and which are completely different animals. Peter Biello: This is the exchange on an PR. So one thing I'll add we're talking about natural dispensers but talking with the conservation officer in the 1980s they recall going to a residence telling a person you can live here but your mountain lion can't. John thanks. And I have to use that word allegedly because there is so much dispute about what people see and what they actually see. Peter Biello: When did you allegedly see a mountain lion. Love hearing these stories. We send out DNA samples to the U.S. Forest Service Rocky Mountain Research Station. So I hate the idea that there's some sort of upward you know downward pressure from the bosses saying Don't you know don't tell about the mountain lions because it'll scare away the tourists. They just end up in these places. So I think in that story there's there's something for the believers and the nonbelievers and I and you know Mark L. Brock is who is a gentleman with the cougar Network told me this story is evidence that that if they were here we would know about it. Patrick Tate New Hampshire Fish and Game Wildlife Biologist thanks very much for being here this morning really appreciate it. We'll also hear your stories if you have them again. What do you think that. Sam Evans-Brown: But I mean the video I had been sent was you know a recording of a animal growling but it was in slow motion and when I asked the person why is this in slow motion the denied that it was so there's a lot of weird stuff that happens in regards to people claiming they've seen they've seen these things. Thanks for taking my call. I have one that's more elaborate than that. Patrick Tate: I've from all the situations I've read and learned about wildlife. Deer Bear Moose Grey Wolf Coyote Foxes Fisher Mountain Lion NH Wildlife History. And you know it's rather interesting because certainly there are those you as a case of mistaken identity or they wanted to see something that perhaps they actually didn't. I had a resident in New Hampshire tell me a story of a mountain lion in the 1960s where a person who would come summer in New Hampshire and then live in a different part of the country in the winter had a trailer that was housing his mount line. Rick van de Poll: Well the mountain lion of course has been sort of an enigma in the wildlife suite for years and years. What's going on. And what was really remarkable about the whole thing was I was maybe a half mile down on all buildings. They're very loyal to what the handler which makes them very dangerous to everyone else. Mountain Lions in NH. If it's someone that has an illegal captive animal that is accustomed to humans those leave a lot of evidence because they want to go around humans to find food meaning they're used to being fed by humans. Well just that I have evidence and it was not it was denied by fishing game at the time and I you know there's I don't need to prove to anybody that I saw one just like some of your callers said okay. For starters, part of the confusion might come from the fact that the eastern cougar was taken off the endangered species list earlier this year. The second one was not only fresh but when I actually put my hand on it it was you know smelled like cat and I it's there's no denying a fresh mountain lions get if you can tell it every story that KOAT. The big cat has been extinct at least the eastern mountain lion has been extinct here since the mid 80s hundreds. Does not test random Scouts. Let us know your story and share your photos. We're going to talk a little bit more about habitat first but then we'll get into sightings. Chartered 1973; Member of District 44-H; . Peter Biello: Wow. So yeah as far as wildlife species that put deer and trees know there aren't any others that I know of that put deer in trees just just humans might be responsible for that. Some of the reports that I looked into that were actually on file at the local fish and game office were even from people who did not live locally. John Holt's ideas were at first dismissed but he refused to be silent. The report came in from a conservation officer. The DNA the DNA that they were able to pull from the cat suggested that it was a dispersed mountain lion that came. He played a pivotal role and he battled for recognition. And here we're talking about in this situation we're talking about it migrated from the West. Do you want to see real, living mountain lions that do exist in New Hampshire. Do you get a lot of these these these things that end up being hoaxes. Maps of Trapping Take by Town 1994 to 2004. I came to a stop and it was and I've seen a lot of bobcats in my time and I just came to a stop it was just sort of confused about what I was seeing. And I can recall its information but I can't confirm or verify anything. Residents from Bedford to Berlin have been reporting sightings for years. www.wildlife.state.nh.us, Buy or Renew Your Saltwater Fishing License, Great Bay National Estuarine Research Reserve. From came from out west they tracked it all the way back to the Black Hills in the Dakotas. I'm gonna send you a letter that we researched this report and we spoke with those labs and the lab wrote in their letter to us that they could only say that Scott contained white Tea Party fur and that they could not say what deposited the scout because it's far too degraded listeners we'd love to hear from you about your mountain lion sightings if you have seen one or if you if you think you have give us a call we'd love to hear your story 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7. We rely on readers like you to support the local, national, and international coverage on this website. For all the men out there that don't realize it. Second when I when they did forward it from Wyoming to to Michigan you know this was coming right from sample 18 and 19 had no remarkable differences from known mountain lions from Michigan or Wyoming. And when provoked no animal could stand before him elegantly put. I've actually had to walk in on one or two now and look at what was going on and figured out what was going on. Each person had their own copy and now it was identify the trees the species of tree matched. Caller: I do. Mountain lions ( Puma concolor) are one of the six native species of wild cats in North America. I was at the Sentinel as a reporter there for about four years and during that time I probably wrote close to a half dozen stories or so on this topic including a lengthy feature at one point that in which I spoke to several people from around the banana region claimed to have seen mountain lions that at one time or another. Peter Biello: Worth mentioning if we're scaring anybody question a mysterious mountain lions lurking perhaps in someone's backyard. Patrick Tate: So I just got to throw a little interesting side note in this. It's bigger but bigger and better world. Let us know your story and share your photos! And those are not the same things. Peter Biello: I did mention four feet nose to tail would be kind of small for a mountain lion. Thank you. Patrick Tate: It's wow interesting that you brought this up because I've had people report I saw cardamom. A 140-pound male mountain lion was hit by a car and killed in 2011 in Milford, Connecticut. m from a weed family Automotive on store Street in Concord is serving the Concord area families automotive needs since 1995. Theres tracks everywhere. There have been several sightings of mountain lions in New Hampshire recently. But along the lines of the conspiracy theories as you mentioned earlier there there was a bit of a sense on behalf of what I'll call the promo online community who felt that fishing gain maybe not even so much in a spoken policy but maybe sort of an unspoken policy did not want to find themselves in a situation where they had to spend money to create a management plan and so forth. Patrick Tate: So one thing I'd say is DNA would definitely identify an animal animal's Mark line or not. There's always been physical evidence to prove those situations like hair or fur scat hair prints pictures of the animal print scat hair. Caller: Absolutely. Information that weed family automotive dot com sunny for today high temperatures low to mid 80s clear tonight overnight lows in the 50s tomorrow sunny highs in the upper 80s. Caller: Are probably. Have it reported down in the Keene area. But if you were to get Western dispersing mountain lions just would just sort of expanding into New Hampshire. Theres a project called the Cougar Network that tracks verified sightings, and they are all around us: Massachusetts, Connecticut, Maine, New York and New Brunswick have all had verified sightings over the past 20 years or so. I can't tell you what you saw but it sounds like a mountain lion. The unheralded hero of Apollo John Hubble the man who knew the way to the moon. Give us a call if you have a question or comments or story about perhaps seeing a mountain lion here in New Hampshire. It doesn't happen as much anymore. However if if and when it does happen it takes up a lot of resources looking at that situation and identifying what's going on because when you start out you don't know it's a hoax. So for those reasons I don't believe the standards are too high the amount of game cameras out on the landscape to record images department alone through contracts had over 150 throughout the state biologists go through various deer yards throughout the year. It traveled all the way from from you know Minnesota to New York without being so seen Patrick take. The supervisor that hired me in the game division in October of 1978 passed on to me this whole big folder of mountain lion information and sightings going back probably a couple decades. I mean so what what is the practical change that it would bring to New Hampshire if any. Me Im willing to believe its possible that there are some out there. When you talk about a bobcat Bobcat maybe 80 90 pounds and then a mountain lion could be between 130 and 180 pounds. And we want to know your stories if you have them 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7 or email exchange at an HP bar dot org we'll talk about conspiracy theories when we come back. People were calling the New Hampshire Fish and Game director's office saying why are you dragging your feet on this. Caller: And the more I thought about it the color of it it was definitely not a bobcat. OK. Rick van de Poll: Rick and I would add that if a mountain lion male takes up residence and successfully finds a female as pets there's gonna be a lot more evidence there will be like deer carcasses up in trees and territorial marking and claw marks and tracks and it you know dispersal is gonna be very tough to see or observed but residential parrots a totally different story. Are these big cats back?Subscribe to WMUR on YouTube now for more: http://bit.ly/1lOjX9CGet more Manchester news: http://wmur.comLike us: http://facebook.com. I wanted to get your thoughts on the mystique of the mountain lion start with you Rick. Mountain Lions in New Hampshire-Fact or Fiction 3,207 views Jul 31, 2019 78 Dislike Share Save New Hampshire Fish and Wildlife 634 subscribers During my thirty-one career at the New. Sam Evans-Brown: And when we talk about subspecies this actually leads to to an interesting tangent which is that the field of biology recently has been sort of revolutionized by the use of DNA to determine what subspecies are. They sent it already. Fish and Game then deny the evidence. That's too big for Bobcat. It doesn't make much sense because you know mountain lions are as we as we said before. Really appreciate it. As far as I could tell there was a positive DNA sequence coming from the scat sample Patrick. Numerous scat and fur specimens have been turned in as part of mountain lion report investigations; DNA identification has shown these submitted samples to be from domestic dog, coyote, bobcat andraccoon. Sue Morse: First and foremost if you have color or if you could see details of color look at the front of the face around the Pumas muzzle the muzzle itself is pure white. I'm Peter Biello in for Laura NOI. All they think it traveled north through Canada up you know crossed across the Great Lakes and then and then down again through New York State. They are the same thing. Patrick Tate: Exactly I was gonna bring that up juvenile male of. Peter Biello: Thank you for sharing that. The most common areas to see mountain lions in Arizona are in places of rocky and mountainous terrain. Gotcha, so the Deep State is suppressing mountain lion news in order to prop up New Hampshire tourism? Less successful males roam further. Verifiable pictures recorded by the observing person or a trail camera. And trying to figure out the little pieces to identify him so I bring up the names the differences but the appearances can be confusing for some. Chartered: 1973 . So I just brought up the bobcat thing because the location is fascinating to me that that that location we have Bobcats existing but that location we have a mountain lion report because it's a developed area and which brings me back to earlier what I had said it's a bouncing ball. Rick van de Poll: Well I didn't. Sandy Hodskins, owner of West Meadow Farm in Bradford, New Hampshire, took time from shoveling Wednesday to enjoy the snow with her horse, West Wind. Mountain lions when they show up they leave evidence. And that the Florida panther was more closely related to the eastern outline than the western mountain lion was. We're gonna talk about sightings in this part of the program as well we'd love to hear your story. So that did it for me. Caller: It had just left that field and was out. Think you've seen a mountain lion. Mark Elbroch doesnt think so. This is not the same as saying that there has never been a mountain lion seen in New Hampshire. So so in 2011 a mountain lion was killed in a car accident in Connecticut a car hit a mountain lion and killed it. Tell us your story. Patrick Tate: In theory it's a passing ball of a court and it goes wherever the bottom Ball wants to go. So. Oh you saw him online. Now that to me seemed to indicate that they had done the secondary workup that in my opinion proved the existence of probably a disperse or possibly from South Dakota like the one in 2011. No that's a little bit outside the range. Peter Biello: We got an e-mail question from Robert in Epsom who asks are sightings or encounters with these big cats less dangerous here where they're passing through than out west where those same mountain lines might be establishing territory Rick. So I did a bunch of research and all the documentation I found was there art are not any pieces of DNA of Eastern online. Monday, December 5th: Mountain Lions in New Hampshire? So we tossed these terms around but really the term subspecies has been sort of redefined in our lifetimes. Mountain lions leave a lot of sign. GAP MOUNTAIN LIONS CLUB Fitzwilliam, New Hampshire (USA) District 44-N . Peter Biello: And that will make identification for a layperson rather difficult. We did a short segment about mountain lion sightings earlier this year and and after which I was sent a photo and also a video recording that was mostly just audio because it was so dark the photo just a quick reverse Google image search you can put images online and see where else where else they've been posted revealed that the photo had been taking out taken out in Wyoming and has been used you know hundreds of times to claim and the person who sent it to me said it had been taken New Hampshire. Some argue that it's a leap of faith. I've seen him in the woods and that was not a bobcat but I was looking at. WMUR uLocal: On this trail cam video, an unidentified feline is spotted. Peter Biello: Hmm. Peter Biello: Mm hmm. And it's not really strong. On a dirt road. Peter Biello: From New Hampshire Public Radio I'm Peter Biello in for Lark Knoy and this is the exchange. JavaScript must be enabled for some features to display properly. So that that's more or less I think why I'm here and why I got into this in nineteen ninety nine I found a what appeared to be a print of a mountain lion and that was in the Osprey mountains and I thought well OK that's that's a print. I hope she's listening and she had spoke to a lot of different people ended up having a couple of sightings of her alone without sort of by accident. Caller: Hey guys how you doing. First off if the standard for an agency to go forward with the public and put out a press release that them outlines here their believers are going to say I told you they'd been here the whole time. What's interesting about Bobcats is here in the Northeast we have some very large bobcats. Wed love to be part of the first verified sighting. List of Mountains in New Hampshire is a general list of mountains in New Hampshire, with elevation.This list includes many mountains in the White Mountains range that covers about a quarter of the state, as well as mountains outside of that range.. You could trace that was this same cat from point to point to point. And so. It was in the spring flash kind of early summer and my wife looked at you look at the size of an adult bear and we were up in arms. So now what's going on. So give us a call now. Information online ad an age student loans dawg. A lot of times. support for an HBO who comes from you our listener Sam from advanced in you a local New Hampshire nonprofit specializing in college student loans and student refinancing options. Part II. Mountain Lions are a mythical creature in New Hampshire with strong feelings on both sides of the question: are there Mountain Lions in New Hampshire? Is this kind of a typical story. Patrick Tate: Martin Like what about Panther Panther saying animals same animal and like a bit of trivia Guinness Book of World Records says the animal with the most names is in English alone they're supposedly 40 names for Mount lion. Thanks for a great thanks. I really really enjoyed listening to this program so thank you all very much. So Michael follows with the question. So here in New Hampshire when a person turns in something that the Department believes is possible mountain lion and believes it should be investigated further. This is a machine-generated transcript, and may contain errors. Yeah I did. Current conditions in New Hampshire would support a mountain lion, according to Tate, as forests have returned, allowing for prey species to become more prevalent. Through DNA they approximate area in the United States or North America where I was born. So nowadays we think of this in the Northeast as crazy stuff that people have a mountain lion as a pet. John you're on the air. So that's the specimen that you find going long distances. That's what we're seeing is dispersing mountain lions from the West who are just making their way through. I mean that so many of them are false sightings we. Phone number 1 800. And sometimes I've seen pictures of those where it's the question is What is that is that a bobcat. We'll be right back. Patrick Tate: So I'm not sure what subspecies of cat they're using to differentiate by those markings but once she was describing the White other face in the black. Yes. The 17-year-old Kiger mustang mare was born in Bend, Oregon, said Hodskins, who got her . It is also known as cougar, panther, mountain lion, and puma, though catamount is the preferred regional vernacular. Lots of people have stories about them, people have them on their game cameras I mean its kind of a thing. Rick van de Poll: Well a report that you know as John Harrigan up north has in co-ops County for about 15 years I kept track of reports and people would call me and tell me where they saw the mountain lion they thought they saw it and it varied right from you know downtown villages all the way to remote highlands of the North Country and and everywhere in between. Get your tickets today and one for fifty dollars or six for 150 at NH PR and board. New Hampshire Public Radio | The big cat has been extinct here since the mid-1800s. If you go on YouTube and search mount lion Pat you can see people patent their hundred pound kiddie like its regular mascot cat. Is that typically what was happening there. Peter Biello: Well Mike thanks very much for sharing your story. So I learned about what Rick just reported through a heart of heart of New Hampshire a letter and. They create these big latrines that are very obvious. No doubt in my mind it was. Despite numerous reports, the NH Fish and Game Department continues to have no physical evidence of mountain lion presence in the state. Seems reasonable! So so do what you can get to do what you can to get proof. They get a lot of media attention but compared to the the amount of times that a mountain lion could attack a person but doesn't because they don't typically view us as prey. Peter Biello: And Carl before you continue I think Patrick Tate just give me a second. Patrick Tate: Same here in New Hampshire too. And so a mountain lion is actually quite large right. I was a Bobcat we saw it and I have a picture of it. So hey, just me shooting from the hip, maybe there are a couple mountain lions skulking about. So it is possible to see male Mountain lions roam into the northeast - there was one hit by a car in CT a number of years back - but we don't have a breeding population of Mountain lions in New England. Have you heard stories do you have questions about the mountain line. It was some sort of a Lion Mountain Lion animal. Anyways after three weeks I finally found the image on line on a field and stream photo contest and the explanation in the end was the person that set the camera out with another individual and they believed that someone who knew of the camera location saw the similarities put the can't picture on their SD card so it looked like that camera recorded the image that is.
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